The Forum.

Donovan Thynedar · Post by **Donovan Thynedar** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 8:47 am

"Delayne, I fear you've touched upon one of Haven's lasting legacies: doubt. There are many in the Haven who doubt the intentions of their fellows, and many more who look with a wary eye at the actions of those who they would call "friend", but it is difficult to convince them otherwise. There is ample evidence for scrutiny and caution. Many in the Haven question my motivations as well, but after a while it stops being a cause for concern. I would rather they be alive, prosperous, and suspicious of me than dead, destitute, and praising my name. Do not take their questioning personally."

"As to the Dragons, I do not know why the remains were taken. I am sure their disposal will require certain precautions at the least. As a person who has used just such a symbol in the past, I will speak no ill of someone who wishes to impress upon people the significance of our actions by displaying a token of a vanquished foe. Yes, the Evil Dragon was a sentient creature. Yes, it was ancient and powerful. And yes, it will leave a void that will doubtless be filled by something new. I respect those truths, and I offer all of Phanterra its due reverence - but I also expect a return of that same courtesy."

"We may not be ancient or magestic, but we are as much a part of this world as any other creature. There are five voids in our number as well, and already we see the balance seeing them filled. We would have respected the Dragon had it wished to live in harmony with us, but that was not the case. It wished to reign in destruction and tyrrany - and I suppose some might argue that it was its right to do so. After all, it was a being of incredible power. Should we have respected its power and cowered before it? I think the answer is plain. No, because when all was said and done we were more powerful than it was."

"I will grieve for the Lady Corel; she was an ally of our people and of the Light, and she will be missed. Still, I do not believe we have seen the last of her, and I do not believe the balance has been upset. We cannot consider ourselves foreign or detached from this world. Our influence is not alien and unnatural, we are a part of of that balance as much as...

*He stops mid-sentence, as if a realization has interrupted his train of thought.*

"Sweet Light, I've heard all this before."

*Turning in his chair, he raises his mug to the sword and sheild above the mantle.*

"I suppose you convinced me after all, old friend."

*He drinks deeply and turns back to Delayne and Dr. Erasmus.*

"I suppose my point is that we are part of the balance as well, with as much right to be in our way as the Dragon had to be in his. Doctor, citizenship is conferred after a person has been presented with our laws and agrees to live by them. We can take care of that after this gathering has been dismissed, if you'd like."

Pugo Redfang · Post by **Pugo Redfang** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 10:33 am

*Pugo gets up and walks over to Delayne places a hand on her shoulder. Stands there as silent as always untill Donovan stops speaking.*

"Delayne I understand what you say. Yet the Freatherd Serpent had shown me this in the night sky the moon before.. That this is not an easy road we must travel now. It shall be harder, be more dangerous, and even be more of us we might be lose. It was the Featherd Serpent that had shown us the light on how to defeat the Jade Serpent. I wish that I could change the lost of your Lady, or the lost we took before and upon those wicked nights. But in time all things come to a close, an all things balance back out to what they need to be. Some for the good of us all, and some not so good for us all. So we are gone to have to wait and see. If the Featherd Serpent can show us a new dawn. Or if we have to forge it out of the darkness some have caused. I know a lot here do not trust my kin, nor me. But I trust you without a blinded eye. Like I Trust Ogrom, Donovan, Dewberry, and Aselayne. If not for you I would have falling into the darkness. Without your light to shine, and without a few others no Redfang to help protect you, no Redfang to take on Jade serpent and his BlackBlood. "

*Pugo stop dead in his tracks and moves around to look Delayne in the eyes.*

"Trust me Delayne something tells me this is far fomr done with. An I agree we need to find your lady, that box, and all the peices you are looking for."

*Pugo Turns around at this point and looks at Donovan.*
"Donovan who has the box that the lady was trapped in? Where is that box so a few might study upon it. Where is sword of who a few of us help build? I am asking for there are a few who wish to understand why them more. Where is place that Dallid felled at? So someone might go make marker for his honor?"

*At this point Pugo looks kind of sad, and turns back to the fire. Pulls out a small animal skull and some dies and begins lacing the lines he had craved into it. An does nto reply to much for a while.*

Donovan Thynedar · Post by **Donovan Thynedar** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 11:21 am

"Pugo, the box itself is in the Duke's possession, and it needs to remain there until we can determine how it might be used to free his child of Narnian's influence. That was the original reason we recovered it, and considering it was taken from him once he is understandably wary of it leaving his sight. Nevertheless, the Duke has agreed to make it available for study. Delayne is assembling a group of sages and interested individuals, and their studies may begin as soon as they are ready."

"I am unsure who possesses the sword. I know at one point it was given to Ka to use against the Dragon, but I know not where it is now. Nor do I know the spot where Dallid rejoined Phanterra, but Drake, Kels, and Woden at the very least should be able to guide us to the location."

Kalphoenix · Post by **Kalphoenix** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 10:48 pm

Delayne nods as Pugo speaks.

"Thank you for your comfort, Pugo...I am sorry to speak out in anger...I am not myself, I make no excuses for my words, but perhaps they could be spoken more peaceably. I am angry for not being here when my Lady was ill and could perhaps have had use for me. I am angry at being given a connection and having it taken away so quickly. I am angry for not being many places when lives could have been spared if I were stronger."

"If the remains of the Dragon are being disposed of properly...then I have no quarrel...I understand that it is a matter of some delicateness and caution. But I would hope that you will send him to his rest soon enough. Greed can be a dangerous enemy...I am aware of the An'Drae'Dar connection to mythril...and I hope this is not the reason why these pieces are being preserved, for the sake of material wealth."

"I have not yet heard from the sages I have contacted, I believe that many are busy with another event...if there are any present who might be willing to assist in this research, please speak with me or Donovan when you have chance to do so, and I would be most grateful."

Amagus · Post by **Amagus** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:50 am

“I do hope the materials of a Greater Being have not simply been tossed away. Every hair, scale, splinter of bone and drop of blood carries incredible potential. ‘Desecration’ is a hollow word. In death has its cares, schemes, motivations and desires ended. In death does it relinquish all claim to the material world. In death does it make itself ours. Such opportunity should not be denied.”

Atrum Draconus · Post by **Atrum Draconus** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 1:36 pm

*Atrum sits quietly as Quen rants and his eyes narrow as he finishes and responds calmly*
You say noone has asked to speak with Malcolm, then I am asking. Hobble along and tell your liege that it's time that the questions of these shared lands be worked out. To me, as long as you're here and choose to support Malcom, you should be considered as a spy, if he asked you would most likely give him any information you have about us. There is no shame in that, you support him wholeheartedly so you SHOULD give him any information about us he asks for. It's that simple, as I said, I have no qualm with you personally, as it seems you have with me, if so I would have laughed in your face when you came to me and asked for the neccesities of survival. You question where I am when things need to be done to the Inn, they are getting done, just the same as defeating the enemies that descend upon us are. Try to remember that while you're here in the lodge while others are out there giving their lives for the safety and soveriegnty of this community.

*Raises an eyebrow to Shale*
You of all should know that I do not buy the support of those that choose to. I am not accusing you, and if the rituals that you gave over were truly innocuous then I have no issue with that at all. And truthfully I would not expect any less of you. *Gives Shale a small smile* I do know that magics can be extremely devastating, as well as alchemy can and just wished to impress upon everyone as to such.

*Turns to Delayne with a saddened look on his face*

I had not heard that Lady Correl was missing, the last I knew she sent us on a mission. Anything that you may need for the task of discovering what has happened or where she may be just ask and if I can give it I will.

*Gives Pugo a mock quizzical look*
Pugo!, You don't trust me, that really hurts.
*Laughs*

Doctor Erasmus · Post by **Doctor Erasmus** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 3:45 pm

I must agree with... Amagus is it? Yes, if anything was left from such a creature it would at the least grant us an opportunity to gain some insight into the beast. I'm also sure any Arcanes or Alchemists could find great uses for any bit of it that remains. This should be done with care... but it should be done.

Kalphoenix · Post by **Kalphoenix** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 7:11 pm

Delayne laughs, but it is a scornful one. "Then, by both of your reasonings...when you are metted out your death...you have no disagreement with being knived up and cataloged for the sake of 'study,' even if it means you would never find your rest."

"Desecration is not a hollow word...for do I remember some time ago when the Gavin tribe near here took similar trophies, and perhaps they were also within their rights to do so...but Haven considered it...a desecration and an uncivilized act."

"By this same reasoning...we should have dissected the body of Claude'du Sinjin...for surely, he had great power before he was struck down. We should not let such materials go to waste!"

"Yes...let us worry all the corpses of the dead to see what scraps we might find, like the carrion beasts of the field, for surely, we have no more convictions than they."

Doctor Erasmus · Post by **Doctor Erasmus** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 8:43 pm

Your scorn is wasted on men of knowledge for the words you speak are true. There is scores of knowledge in death. Through dissection I have learned much of numerous creatures in this region. Through understanding of anatomy you learn how to heal... and how to kill, more efficiently.
As for creatures of power, their bodies hold vast reserves of information and power simply waiting to be tapped that are far too often allowed to rot away by those not willing to "desecrate" a corpse as you put it.

Now then, as to this Claude du Sinjn you mentioned... please, describe this power he possesed...

Kalphoenix · Post by **Kalphoenix** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 9:13 pm

Delayne turns towards the doctor. "He suffered from a disease of some sort that twisted his body and occasionally turned him into a sickened creature bent only on slaughter. He was very powerful in this form, and only seemed to gain control of himself after he joined the Dragon." She says.

"What I find more disturbing, I mentioned the effect that the Dragon's blood had on the surrounding lands. It attracted many creatures to attack Haven. I find the idea that there may be parts of him still here to be dangerous, at the very least."

"If his remains are to be studied, however distasteful, I hope it is being done quickly, for the safety of Haven, if nothing else."

Pugo Redfang · Post by **Pugo Redfang** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 9:52 pm

*Pugo smirks at Atrum*

"Oh no I trust you as if you were my kin. You are as close to blood as Dewberry. You have just not tasted the fire like he has. But sometime soon you and Ogrom shall drink of the fire. Than you will truly be kin to us. It was weaved into the nights long ago. "

*Pugo looks back at the small skull he has been working on and shrugs as it crumbles into pieces. A look of oddness comes over his face. Than he look back at Atrum.*

"I am gone to go hunt up Dewberry he should be here for this."

*He gets up and walks out without speaking or saying anything more.*

Doctor Erasmus · Post by **Doctor Erasmus** » Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:48 pm

Hmm, diseased you say... yet you know nothing of the origins of this ailment? Was it naturally occuring? Was it magical in nature? Possibly even created? How was the disease transferred and is it curable?

No, I suppose it is not... you referred to him as if he were dead and gone. So I assume the body is also gone, with any chance to learn from it. A pity. Power wasted. Information can be gathered from those who witnessed it, but such methods are highly suspect and offer little true insight.

Regardless, yes Sir Thynedar. After this Forum I would be glad to review the Laws and responsiblities of citizenship.

Kalphoenix · Post by **Kalphoenix** » Tue Dec 13, 2005 1:35 am

"I am sure if you asked around you might learn more...I only know that the disease was transfered through wounds...and possibly contracted through death by the creature that it originated from. I believe that Claude died and was later revived after being attacked. I was not there when the event occured, so I do not know the details...neither do I know how the body was disposed of...I believe it may have been burned. As far as I know, there was no cure. No normal means of healing were able to do so, so I believe it was magical in nature. He would periodicly turn into a very strong sort of feral creature whereupon he would attack anything near him with abandon. He claimed he did not recall these events when he was not transformed."

Delayne shakes her head. "He was a good man, in life, and in the end thought himself forsaken, believing his only path lay with the Dragon. He was consumed totally by the creature he became. It may have been wiser to end his misery sooner, rather than let him live on in pain and sickness, but it was not my decision to make."

Delayne fixes the doctor with a stare. "I am not saying you do not have a point, but there are special circumstances surrounding the Dragon and his death. It is more than a desecration, it is dangerous. The remains are also a tempting target."

Nelkie · Post by **Nelkie** » Tue Dec 13, 2005 8:37 am

I have been thinking and I have an idea.

I would like to see a system established in where all the guilds communicate with each other by a concile, to an appointed person, etc... which will help manage current and new trade routes. This group of people or person would help make sure all of Havens requirements are meet. Making sure there is enough food for everyone, cloth, supplies, etc.. This group would not control the resources but give suggestions on what new trade routes are required, where support needs to be lend, in basic terms, make sure haven resources requirements are meet through communication between all guilds of haven and an understanding what is needed.
Now resouces still could be traded between guilds on the current trade ratio system, or given freely.
Maybe a banking system could be established where all the resources are deposited in a safe location, and people are given coins in return for the resources. The coins in turn would be used to purchase what resources they need, equipment, services, drinks, etc...
An example is the the Guild of Fire depsoits 10 food resources intot hebank. The bank in return gives the Guild of fire 10 coins used for trading purposes for other stuff. The guild of Fire would not need to protect the resources, carry them around, etc..
9OGG: Please note here is a rule found in the book which has not been followed by most people:
How Many Resources May I carry
[b]Also of note, a person may carry a maximum of any six resources. For example: Thor the mighty carries six steel, while Grumsh the Everhungry carries 6 food. A more normal individual, Farmer Joe, may carry 3 food, 2 cloth, and one supplies. Any additional resources must be stored in some location. Any resources not carried must be left in the open or stored in a container about the size of an 18-gallon tote or bigger.[/b]

Are people interested in doing this? If so who would like to help?

Doctor Erasmus · Post by **Doctor Erasmus** » Wed Dec 14, 2005 7:06 pm

There are always dangers associated with the study of the dead. Be it disease, internal parasites, or others who would collect your subject for their own needs. That does not mean however that we roll over in the face or fear and uncertainty and allow these opportunities to pass us by.

I also do not mean to insinuate that I should have access to the remains. I'm sure it will be some time before I've recovered from my journey... I'm not trained in wilderness survival and my trek was rather taxing for that lack. Not to mention, I was often... distracted.

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Idea