October 2011 Feedback

What did you think of the last event? Post your opinions and disucss the comments of others here!

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GM-Taki
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October 2011 Feedback

Post by GM-Taki »

I had a great time this game, but I noticed that the atmosphere seemed a bit off. People seemed a little stressed and impatient at times, but I can’t put a finger on a specific reason why. Also, being at the Inn and away from the official leadership of Haven can keep me out of touch with the goings-on, but even as a secondary participant I felt like the pacing was a half-beat slow.

Aside from a couple of instances where conversation strayed OOG, I was pleased by the roleplaying I participated in and observed. I thought Legion, Francesco, Noble, Nell and Serith all had some great scenes, and I particularly enjoyed talking with Gabriel and Garrett as we tried to figure out what to do with the An’Dar. On the NPC side, I liked Sen (Eric Brand), Eldorras "Big Poppa" (Brad B.), Sir Bartholomew (Mike) and though he frustrated Korrigan to no end, Fred (Chris).

I was extremely pleased with the way my one complaint was handled by the GM staff. When some other players were displeased with a situation in-game I suspected that a miscommunication was at fault. I made it known to the GM’s who not only confirmed my suspicions but dealt with the situation in a way that addressed the situation as best as it could be addressed.

It also appears that the Camp is pressuring us more and more to be out earlier, so one thing I would suggest is an established “game off” time around 10:00am. Sunday mornings have been inactive for a long time, and since we’re regularly running till 4:00am I don’t mind setting up something more predictable for checkout and clean-up. This would also guarantee more people would be around when the time comes to clean the buildings, and many hands make light work. Boro (Paul) deserves special consideration for cleaning up the Inn on several occasions over the weekend, and I’m grateful to the Dwarves + Rothek for the help they gave me in the Inn Sunday morning.

On that note, I’d also like to thank Jared personally. Because Korrigan is hip-deep in the economic system and tends to be aggressively pro-active in everything he does, I find myself hounding poor Jared quite a bit. He’s done a good job managing the economy from the GM side, and since that’s something that not many people actually see, I wanted to give him the credit he deserves.

Let me qualify the following observation by saying that I don’t go on many plots. Normally my activities are very Inn-centered, and everybody knows it. That said, and even after spending the first six years of this game fighting off one world-ending catastrophe after another, there was a special thrill in the feeling that the shit was about to hit the fan. I hadn’t felt that in a while, and when the battle at the Keep went as quickly as it did I was worried I might be disappointed. The Cave battle afterwards delivered the brawl I was looking for, and there was a point (right before I sent in the Ice Ifrits) where I was seriously concerned for the outcome. Later, the sneak attacks were a fun shock to the system and afterwards I found myself smiling contentedly and watching the steam rise out of my armor into the cold night air. It was a good, good feeling.

Thanks for another great year, everybody. I can’t wait till we do it all again next season.

Also, if you're reading this, please take the time to leave some feedback of your own. The GM's and NPC's need to hear what we have to say!
GM-Taki - Final Haven GM, Winter Haven GM, Editor of the Rulebook Project.
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Post by Torakhan »

Heh. Hey, I know I only showed up late on Friday and left at the end of Game Break, but don't hurt me cuz you know I'm not the "glorious" type. ;)

Friday night (early Saturday morning) I rolled in and expected to have to go about doing stuff and never actually left the Inn after that. *chuckle* It seemed like the Inn was often empty, and when folks would manage to amass in any numbers, there was something to pull them out to do things, so I hope that meant that people were active and drawn to some fun plots.

I tried to be as "Helpful/Out of the way" as I could from behind the bar as Quen really can be as the coward he is... Apparently Quen's job is to save folks inside the Inn now (whether the person he's saving is inside or outside of the building. Remember: Use Windows!)

While I had originally intended on staying only until Game Break, my lack of sleep the night before, and the IC fear of another attack on the Inn leaving Quen dead made it seem prudent that he would leave before the hammer fell that evening. I hear that it was quite a thing though (not that Quen would have been doing anything more than watching from the windows of the Inn/Fort anyways.)

Thank you to the NPC and GMs. Even after 3am on Saturday, you guys still popped in several times. :)

I hope the rest of the event was great for everyone and can't wait to hear all of the stories later from it. :)
Arthur Dreese - West Michigan
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Post by Abaddon »

I had a fun event all around.

I love Jared's Valkyn'vi plot, but the sudden wind up felt awkward and rushed. Information changed and I HATE retcons. I love Time and the fact he would rather vomit on my shoes than help me but he has to.

The Red Tear Battle in the cve was AMAZING. Counterspell is always a scary spell to invest in as a wizard since it's use is depended on the battle. I have spend years and gold making sure I can kick wizards in the groin, and I ran out of tools during this fight and I LOVED that. I couldn't keep up and I had to make hard choices about spells to counter.

There were alot of Game stops, I heard other PCs complaining but my only complaint is that it was hard to tell them apart so we could get caught when we thought it was game off. That needs to be louder and more clear.

I liked Fionna's work together speech in the keep after the guys went after Zeira.

On DOORS.
Jared's barred door call was well done, that being said, knocking down a door is a CHARGED SKILL. It takes time and FAILS if it is interrupted. If we drive the bad guys off, or interrupt them by casting long cool down spells that put me into a walking coma, the door is fine. If you are going to change it to a "hits" based rule please tell us AHEAD of time. The door NEVER should have come down.

PCs, stop interrupting scenes because you think your scene with the GM are more important.

I like the new NPC camp rules, as an experiment, and I never felt like I couldn't get my stuff. :)
"I would only teach them Necromancy as part of a balanced breakfast."
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Post by Shea Stonebrook »

Over all I had a good time..... Loved interacting with people...Francesco before he left, Rothek taking me through the woods to the inn to build a door (that I guess I didn't have to build??) passing little things with the Dwarves, walking with Boro Sat looking for herbs, watching the decision for people to leave and bring back Zeira, Dalid having a vision that that group shouldn't and then with Fionna & , seeng the machine coming in and Fionna before the last battle when she came back with Orien and Gabriel. cool cool stuff. And the weather was Awesome!!

I didn't go out on many plots, but I enjoy hearing info when people come back to the Keep... (what happened?!) I don't know if it was the message or the messenger but things seemed pretty confusing... infomation (imho) seemed a bit mixed up cause there was a lot to gather... Remember when Donovan kept a book that we'd come and tell him things and he'd WRITE it down, maybe next time I'll start doing more of that....just a thought.

I like the idea of the board at NPC camp but it's got a lot of "tweeks" before it does what it's supposed to do...I had no clue, when it said "closed" it was still okay to knock...I found out it was. I took the word "closed" was a "do not disturb sign" Honestly didn't REALLY know what to expect... asap isn't a time??? and it's easy to sit and wait like we have done for a long long time.... more direction please

Lastly...I respect the GM's and the NPC's!! Thank them and appreciate all they do. From the writing to the running!! I really really do!! I know that we are ALL human, and we are not close to perfect BUT the One thing that I had a very very hard time with....that I was in shock and AWE that happened was Sat at around 3:30 something VERY SIGNIFICANT happened, 2 PC's were "down" All I knew was that I couldn't tell if they were dead or alive??!!....I needed detail as to what thier body was doing....was the heart beating though no one was home? was there any breathe? or is this body turning ,cold and clammy.... those were the kinds answers I needed.... NOT to tell me the ending of the story that my character has to live for the next few months.... we didn't ask for ALL the information....just enough. Why? Why Why Why? I would rather have gone home wanting and did something on the boards....

I remember pregnant Robin and the flaming P just before she was going into labor. THAT was epic, this could have been close.... now it's "no big deal" ..................................................................................................................................................................................................................................thanks
Last edited by Shea Stonebrook on Wed Oct 26, 2011 6:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Malachi »

I enjoyed the majority of the event. I particularly enjoyed the plot to retrieve Demonslayer, and found it amusing who became the original 'chosen one'. As for combat, the saturday night cave battle with the Red Tear was fantastic, with two notable exceptions. The obscene number of game stops made it difficult to stay 'in scene', and there were multiple occasions that I didn't know that we were in game until another game stop was called. I understand that we were facing a group of wizards, but they're known for necromancy more than anything. Maybe they could send hordes and hordes of undead minions against us, with maybe two or three wizards. The second issue came forth when I began watching for wizards exclusively. I saw what I thought was a wizard and hit the NPC dead in the chest with a packet-driven taunt. The NPC responded by placing his hand on his head and walking to the back of the group of other NPCs. I could understand if it was a kill call, but taunt? I'll PM the specific NPC involved to the GMs, so they can make their ruling as they see fit.

The plot involving the room that turned people to stone irritated me to no end. Petrification is by far the deadliest attack in the game, period. The balancing factor of the 'Flesh to Stone' potion is that it takes 5 minutes to become permanent, during which time a 'Cleanse' potion will negate its effect. If that isn't done, it requires a Master level potion, and even then the victim is required to draw a (unaltered) minimum of 5 chips to be brought back to life. Even with the 'Death' call when we re-took Haven, a Healer with Surgery could resuscitate you if they got there in 15 seconds or less.

That being said, instant mass petrification is disgusting. Yes, there were certain skills that could get around it, those being Dodge, Dive for Cover, Avoid Trap, Resist Magic, and Sure-Footed, but we were only allowed to use these skills (which normally have nigh-unlimited use) once for no discernible reason. Had we been given an IG reason as to why, it may have irked me less, but we were only given "you can only use those skills once in this scene".

The biggest issue I had with the event was dealt with on-site as soon as the GMs were made aware of it, and for that I thank all of you.

The RP with the people in the Keep about the ritual to get Ziera back was awesome, as was pretty much every PC/NPC interaction I had this event. I especially liked the scene with Adam when he was playing the woodland spirit who charged the crystal. I can honestly say that the scene went exactly opposite of what I had expected.

All and all, I had a great time this weekend, and can't wait for next year!

Oh yea, I almost forgot my absolute favorite part of the event: When Paer'An came in and killed everyone! Boy, you sure showed us!
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Post by Kiel Reid »

I had an awesome time at the event.

I don't usually go on a lot of plots that have to do with the main storyline but this event I found myself out doing those things. I had a blast going out and getting the Demon Slayer sword. I liked the teamwork elements that were required like hitting the monsters at the same time and joining hands to go across the lava.

I also thoroughly enjoyed the Slade, Gregory and Batholomew plot. Those are two of my favorite things to do and I'll be sad that I won't be able to do them again. Fighting Chris, Bill and the new guy was epic. Best fight I have had in a looooong time. I was out of breath at the end which was how I knew was a good time.

The death of Francesco was awesome. I gotta give big props to Eric on what happened because I never saw that coming. I wish you guys could have seen it all go down.

I'm glad to have Zeira back and look forward to playing him in the future. I had some fun interactions with Leo late Saturday night. I liked playing a warrior but can't wait to start playing a Sage again.

I also was not a fan of the amount of game stops during the wizard battle. I would have liked to have seen more weird undead creatures or strange dark magics or a few curses. Everything else in the battle was awesome though.

Great job guys and I look forward to next season!!!
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Post by Smitty19 »

Ok, here's my feedback...

Overall had an excellent time!

Was always busy on plots and had lots of fun running around with desperation on Saturday night as the shit was about to hit the fan....

The good:
By far the best plot I was on was the plot to retrieve Demonslayer...It was great seeing us all work together and solving problems first by trying the diplomatic way rather than going in guns blazing...

My second favorite plot was the Red Tear Ritual cave when as a first we as a town were proactive rather than Reactive! I'm not gonna lie, being able to add slay to my calls was a blast, and I will never forget the look on Dan's Face as I used the Beasts head as a dodgeball and then proceeded to beat his NPC down!

Ohh and my favorite call of the weekend....15 Magic Slay Curb Stomp...

The bad:

Talked to Mike a bit about this, but I personally do not like the An'dar stuff....no offense meant, but I really don't like Sci-Fi in my Fantasy.... That is just my personal feeling, and I really would like to start seeing more plots revolving around some Fantasy staples, such as dungeon crawls to clear out marauding goblins, or intercepting an Orc horde from Razing a Village....maybe that's just me though...

The Ugly:

This has already been stated, but the only issue I had was the resoultion of the Orien, Gabrial death... I couldn't get back into character after that, and was sad because my Character would have had a Huge reaction, and could have lead to some great rp, but ended up as something really meh...

Great fun was had, and I am looking forward to next year! Special shout out to the npcs and GM's without you guys we would have no game! Thanks a ton for making such an interesting and diverse world for us to be able to play in....
Serith Darkheart

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Post by Glane Goldvein »

Doing this for the first time was too much fun!

At first I was worried that I would Sometimes get get included, but that obviously changed when I told my back story to the dwarfs. I felt like a member of the town after the first night; people were inviting and the GMs helped when they could.

I loved the plots that I went on. Again, I felt like I was part of it and that, even though there might have been a cluster of people, I was important to the success of the group. There were great moments where I actually felt like I was in danger and that I needed to act now or have a chance of dying. The moments were when the group went to retrieve the An'dar machine weapon that Orion used and after that when part of the group stayed at the inn when there were a ton of zombies. Having moments where somebody feels like they're in danger or they feel like they are the key to success is great when it comes to story telling.

GM Brad's plot was very cool. Having PCs write in parts of the plot was a fun / good idea.

I am totally coming to the next event. I can't wait to see what happens (plot wise / character development) in the future!
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Post by GM-Mike »

So everyone else thought the event was perfect then?
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Post by Grimm »

*sigh* I’ve been trying to decide how to approach my feedback. To be honest… almost all of my event was amazing. The things that went wrong, however… were SO wrong… that it completely ruined the event for me and ended the season with tears and anger. Yes… genuine ANGER.

THE GOOD:

Fionna – woman… one again, you made my event. I LOVE role playing with you SO much. You have stepped into the hardest job in game and with grace, strength, and determination owned it. Haven is lucky to have you.

Gabrial and Serith – my boys… You make Orien worth playing. The intensity of the role playing, the depth of story and dedication… I love you both.

Laliah and Leo – in your own ways, both of you were so important to me this event. From Laliah’s kind strength, to Leo’s energetic loyalty, you both really touched Orien’s heart. I can’t wait to see what the future brings.

The Dwarves (especially Eric Coon) – the fight with you on Saturday completely changed how Orien sees you. When no one else was willing to go… to risk almost certain death, you were. You followed Gabe and I into hell, and stood unflinching. I would shed blood with you ANY day.

Hammer – All I can say is thanks. No one else will ever know or understand… but you do when I say thank you. You have but to call and I will ALWAYS be there. Without question.

Noble, Viktor, and Legion – my Night squad. I may not always agree with your methods, but there are no three I would rather have my back. We’re a family… and that means something. Thank you for being the defenders Haven needs.

The Red Tear Cave on Friday was awesome. Wonderful role playing from both PC’s and NPCs with balanced combat and wonderful scene construction. I really felt that was a perfectly executed combat plot that still always felt like a role playing scene. Absolutely the same for the An’Dar bunker on Saturday night. That fight was one of the best role playing scenes I had all event, because the immersion was fantastic, the NPC’s remained in character, and really pushed the PC’s. I loved both, and I am not usually a combat person. Beautiful execution for both, thank you!

The Keep remained clean and pretty much everyone picked up after themselves!! THANK YOU!!

THE BAD:

Someone broke MY whiteboard. That is INACCEPTABLE. I don’t care how unhappy or frustrated you are, you have NO right to abuse the personal property of another person at the game. I am very disappointed that adults do not seem to know how to behave.

*Edited Out*cn

People assuming something is OOG… or NPC driven when they don’t have all the facts. DO NOT assume the worst of someone just because you think you know what’s going on. News flash… PC’s LIE. NPC’s LIE. Before you jump off the handle, be SURE you have ALL the facts before you take it out of character. There was some very unacceptable conduct from several people and many feelings got hurt that didn’t have to. Unless you have a damned good reason to believe the worst, please try not to.

THE UGLY:


EDIT: my honest feedback is not actually wanted, and is in danger of causing trouble with a real life friendship that matters more to me than this game. Removed.

So – while I otherwise had a great event… the close of the game and season really broke me. With the negative conduct of some of the players, and some of the GMing decisions… I’m honestly GLAD the season is over. I’m too hurt and upset to want to play for a long while… and that’s sad. I love this game, and I love the people, but when something hurts you that much, it’s time to take a break.

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Post by Leo »

I SLEPT THROUGH THE FINAL BATTLE!!! I am a bit disappointed that my life wasn't in direct danger...

Definatly loved the window being our "Scale the wall" exit.

Gabriel, always a pleasure Rping and battling along side you.

Orien you have a way about you, I dont yet understand. One day it'll be me doing all the dangerous choice stuff, and having to lay my life down. I'll make you proud, I swear.

Borro, I met you this event quit a bit more formally then last, I'm glad to have fought along side you. You do it like the best of them.

Korrigan, always a pleasure.

Ah and Shea thank you so much for being with me whilst I got a flat and had all the issues on the way, I appreciate that more then I can say.

Viktor, I'm impressed. I thought you were just one of the old folk, as it turns out you got quite a bit more spunk in you then I expected. I had a great time Rping with you.

Oh yea, and Damn Serith! You kill zombies good. Obliterating them infact.

Fiona thank you again for making all the best decisions you could, I'm proud to stand at your side. You've not shown my gut any reason to doubt you. And my gut knows all...

Great job on the Npc's part, you took a beating like usual and made the event more then worth the drive. I had a great time running with your plots, even though the waits were a bit impatient on my part. The board system was a good idea, just the refinement of the Npcs availability would be nice. I was hoping to be a bit more scared for my life then I was. After hearing the impending doom news, I was freaking. As it all came to pass i was like "This isn't that bad, just zombies...", then I fell asleep.

All around good event hope to see you all next year, as a collage student.
Leo Edanis of Geldaland

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Post by GM_Chris »

There was a bunch of stuff players did in the background that ended up stopping a bunch of the bad stuff planned before it got real bad so the doom was not so doomish.
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Post by Dallid »

As the event started, I hated that new white-board with all my heart and soul. The way it was explained made it a complete and total disconnect between PCs and NPCs. No one was supposed to ever wait outside NPC Camp or knock on the door. If you want to talk to an NPC for any reason, write your name and the name of the NPC on the board and they’ll eventually get back to you. The first entry I made took over two hours for the NPC to finally come out and try to find me. And going out on plots? Forget it! You had to gather your group, go and write your name on the board, then return and wait with your group until an NPC finally arrived. With such wait times being hours long, there was no way this could work. I had to try very hard to find NPCs out and about to try to pursue plots or deal with issues with them. I had to focus more on snatching chances at GM communication than on RP and it sucked big time.

Then Saturday morning came and I gathered a group to go after the daemon sword. I wasn’t about to have them wait around while I went to put my name on the board and return, then wait forever for an NPC to respond, so we all just set off for NPC Camp. Screw the damn board, I was going to knock on the door and we were *going to wait outside*.

Then we saw NPC Camp was still closed. At 11:00 in the morning. As others did, I assumed that meant ‘do not disturb’. It was tough enough getting the group together, and the thought of turning around and giving up was too much. I snapped. I grabbed up that hated board, opened the door, and slid it across the floor toward the NPCs gathered inside (did not throw, as Chris exaggerated). I did not break the board, but regardless that was an overreaction and I apologize for it.

Over the course of the rest of the day, it was gradually explained that, yes, we *can* knock on the door and we *can* wait outside for running plots. The board was there for PCs who want to tie up the GMs with ridiculous quantities of one-on-one time. That certainly sounds reasonable and productive – I can get behind that.

But the frustration and drama caused by the initial poorly explained purpose of board pretty much ruined the first half of the event for me.

This was exasperated by in-game interactions with the Dwarves. Wanted to go take on the Kraken, but the Dwarves took over an hour to get ready. Then, after telling the GMs we wanted to do the plot, they decided it was now time for lunch. Clearly they wouldn’t be ready for hours more, so I moved on to a different plot before the day disappeared entirely. So now Dallid was helping retrieve the bone scroll. But the dwarf involved was unwilling to share any information. So I gave up, went back to the keep, and read a book for the rest of the afternoon.

Then things picked up. I got to play a pivotal role in multiple scenes. Meeting with the Spirit of the Wood was a fine RP moment. Fighting alongside and RPing with the dwarves when they’re finally ready was awesome, and the zombie fight was wonderful. While the last-second Clue-by-four vision leaves an impression that the plot was poorly executed, stopping the resurrection of Ziera with literally one or two seconds to spare was thoroughly exhilarating. Being a witness and participant in Francesco’s and Ashearth’s final scenes was equally fantastic. And the battle at the Red Tear cave was absolutely amazing! I recognize the necessity of spell-related Game Stops, so have no issues there. The battle was a total blast.

But all the joy I had built up during those events was then completely sucked away.

Please understand that Dallid never receives so much as a single copper during Final Haven events. He focuses on the Good Fight, and those plots never give out any items or money. If there is anything to be had, other PCs swiftly snatch it up. Dallids only rewards are RP-related – connections, experiences, and reputation. So I was very upset to hear Ashearth had been encountered and killed again.

That completely negated the coolness of the previous scene with him and Francesco and painted Dallid as a liar. During that scene, Eric had ad-libbed a few details that probably weren’t quite kosher rules-wise to make the scene more interesting (possessing Francesco’s body and rising as a zombie). They worked very well as no one was really compromised by the details and they did add to the experience. When I heard another Ashearth had been encountered, I assumed this was another ‘coolness’ detail Eric had added, but this one *did* compromise Dallid’s integrity. So when I saw Chris, I asked him to tell Eric to ‘can the vanity plots’.

But I was wrong about the source, and I’m sorry, Eric. If I hadn’t been so upset from earlier events and my temper shortened by the late hour, I probably would have just kept it in-game as I should have. As I was told OOG the actual source, I cannot RP Dallid’s response without meta-gaming, so I’m just going to have to try to forget the whole thing.

But the truth left me equally upset for different reasons. And given all the anger and frustration I felt at this event (including anger at myself for taking in-game stuff so personally), I left bound and determined never to come back.

However, after much thought, I realize most of the worst of these issues had all ready been resolved, and what’s left is actually pretty minor and mostly in-game. There was a lot of good about this event that was just overshadowed by the bad. And while I still have to say this was perhaps my worst event ever, I do realize it’s not indicative of the future. Plus a plotline I’ve been pursuing for the last four years is apparently set to run next year. :)

Now I need to try to get my checkout taken care of online so I’m legal for the next event.
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Post by NOBLE »

I just wanted to say even though it is a little late that I thought the event was a blast. Some of the negatives have already been stated and addressed that I had so no need to go further there. I had an absolute blast rp'ing with the pc and npc base. Brad and Mike are responsible for a scene that still makes me laugh out loud when I think of it. Best robbery of an old man on a road ever. Thanks for the show guys, it was awesome. But to all staff members thankyou for taking the weekend and making it so much fun and entertaining for us. I appreciate it.
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Post by Happy Windfall »

Second time actually PCing FH instead of NPCing, and I can honestly say I had something to do at every single moment I was awake until post-Red Tear Cave. I had a blast with so many characters, ran off on so many different plots, I'd probably regurgitate everyone's name if I did individual shout-outs.

Most memorable parts of the event for me:

Repairing rings and making a necklace for the Dwarven King. Really got to act out the 'jeweler' background of my character. ^_^

Being caught off guard with a bunch of other people and put into a Time Stop spell.

The Dwarven Archway plot. That the NPCs/GMs anticipated that I'd apply my scant archaeology knowledge was funny at the time. Though in retrospect, I apologize for hounding you guys about the 'impressions' I took at the event before. That we've managed to come up with a few theories about it is exciting in that suspenseful mystery way, but having had no immediate way of advancing the plot itself was frustrating.

:oops: Big sorry to everyone about running off during a Game Stop at the An'dar bunker plot - it just goes to show how intense the scene was that I completely forgot it *was* a Game Stop! :D

The bone scroll case plot and its accompanying delay plot! (Sorry I helped to make your day crappy, Doug.)

The Avatar plot and everything I did and those I interacted with because of it was fun.

Red Tear Cave: there's a different quality to FH and WH's season ending Final Battle. In FH there's a mass breaking out of awesome special abilities/items from the PCs, where for WH it feels like a hack-and-slash, tactics-driven, solve the puzzle in time, and maybe we've enlisted the help of a neighboring clan to deal with the majority of the rabble while the PCs focus on the big bad. Not saying one is better than the other.

The only real peeves I had this event was the ever present "I have so much I want to research between events, but I can only apply it to one plot" syndrome I have, and the blatant disregard for the sanctity of the enemy dead (though I own that this peeve has to do with me being a bit sensitized right now due to some real life issues).

GMs/NPCs - I'll get you Nell's backstory as soon as I can.
-- "Nellie Duncan, but please, just call me Nell."

"My Honor is in my craft, not my word... But I guess I should make an effort to build that up, too."
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