suicide?

and we only charge them everything we can scrounge...

That'd be a schweeet shirt!
Haven - Kevorkian ain't got nothing on us!

Actually, someone has committed suicide in game.

With their own 33 boom to the chest.

There was no GM call against it, so I suppose it's totally legal.

Nope, you can always choose to not play a character.

Infact it makes for a good story. Some PC's start torchering someone and don't do a good job and let him/her die. I think it is great. Infact it is probably good RP to kill yourself at times. Forexample, you are just really surprised by an assassin, so good infact you decide to just die.

It is all good.

I think that is a bad message to send. People just dieing at the drop of a hat to get away from something else they don't want to deal with then getting rezed later.

I'd say the high likelihood of perm death is a prefectly reasonable trade-off. I mean the opposition isn't just going to go "Oh, he's dead. I guess we'll hand the body back." At a minimum, the body will more than likely be destroyed to a point where it is very hard to rez. At worst they rez and the player decides no the body isn't rezable and is forced to make a new character. (assuming a torture situation)

(just for note: I'd have to call total cheese on being allowed to deny one rez but accept another later.)

(just for note: I'd have to call total cheese on being allowed to deny one rez but accept another later.)

As it stands right now, I believe that it is the character's choice whether they wish to be returned to the land of the living when they're "called upon". Should "declining" a call back to the body count against an "attempt" and thus make it impossible to rez them later, or does the decision not to "answer the call" keep someone from suffering through the stress and inability to make that full-reuniting with the body and Essence? I don't know if it's come up, but it might be nice to have a call by the GMs.

Then again, it used to be thought that the Essence of the dead was too weak to be re-coalesced after 3 weeks... but some "recent" activities have shown that that is not necessarily the case.

Let's not mix rules and 'roleplaying effects', shall we? The whole point is that if you decline, it's the same as pulling a red chip. No effect involved.

[GM_Chris]

My brain is unable to handle the complications of this post.

You can kill yourself? yES
Does it need to be a count? No
If you kill yourself can you be rezzed later? Sure
If a rez is performed can you decline? Yes

If something somewhere is cheesed will the boom stick come down? Yep

Will it go in a rule book? No

As a side note, if a Gm told me that I couldn't kill off my own character I would be very tempted to flip said GM off and walk away from the scene.

By the way this post of mine can be considered caanan so no more guessing about what you can and cannot do.

I think the difficulty here is in that while it is true that the player has the right to play or not play his character as he sees fit there is a gray area when it involves ‘death.’ And in my opinion both Travis and Chris make valid points.

At WH we have try to stick to the letter of the rules for clarity and fairness to all parties. So, it is important to us to get things straight. In the game death is a mechanical function usually. You take X points/effects for X long you are ‘dead.’ It is a process which people outside yourself have sway over, and can influence. Healers can stabilize, empaths can transfer, warriors can beat you further to death… So it stands to reason that ‘self damage’ would need to follow the same conventions. That way people around you can react and interact. If someone slits their wrists in front of a group of healers they probably can stop the bleeding in time. Or, if they put a razor to their own thrat that a rogue could quickly grab the blade away in that moment of hesitation (counting). I suspect that characters doing this, much like people in real life, are looking for a dramatic moment and in fact want to be saved.

Chris is all about the dramatic moment, so the mechanics aren’t as big a concern. A guy stabs himself in the throat and dies… Why complicate it?

My issue is with the idea that a player can choose to die at the drop of a hat. Like Chris’ torture heart attack example. Yeah, there will never be a rule for something like that. But, if someone is captured and being tortured to be implanted with a suggestion and they choose to die… isn’t that unfair to the guy who did all the work to catch the victim secretly? What if the victim gets rezed, caught, and does it again? Would you then call cheese, and make them stay alive? Wouldn’t that by your own accounts be a GM trying to force a player to play their character (And get the finger)? Is the only deterrent that you’ll eventually find someone so miffed that they hack you up into mulch or you get kicked out?

So, I say the answer is somewhere in between. Can you damage yourself with booms and swords… definatly.

Can you killing blow yourself… Yes. Because technically you are not trying to defend yourself ie… helpless. But do more than just “I am killing myself. 1, 2, 3, I am dead.” Play it up.

Can you just choose to fall over limp… Yup. But please, don’t use it as an escape, pull cheese dick maneuvers, or make the game less fun for anyone else. Play by the spirit of the game.

You do realize that by dying, your character is *dead* right? I only ask because you seem to miss the simple fact when you are dead, you have a real risk of perm death. If someone keeps dying to avoid torture, maybe the torturer shouldn't be an idiot and give the body back once the torture fails. If I was torturing someone and they just died on me, I'd do enough damage to them to make rez impossible.

As for cheese, what if rather than death during the torture, the player walks into a battle and commits assisted suicide via a monster? Or slits their own throat while alone?

By the way this post of mine can be considered caanan so no more guessing about what you can and cannot do.

... just because text online is ambiguous at best... was that comment meant to be funny, or are you unilaterally making a call on behalf of all GMs and Final Haven?