Final Haven changes for 2014

[Ark]

and thus the second (third?) cataclysm came to pass, and the game kaylen ball created at the same time.

[Kaylan Chargeender]

HEY...HEY...none of that making your Arch Enemy laugh his ass off and sheeeyit! We will have NONE of that humor here MR....

*glare...glare...glare*

[taymoonlight]

Wouldn't that be Ark enemy? lol.

[Ark]

Wouldn't that be Ark enemy? lol.

oh ho very punny XD

[Marcus]

Mike, all I have to ask is that you please be cognizant that some of us are not very good at writing, and have suffered for it (or at least got that as a very strong impression) at both WinterHaven and Finalhaven.

Having to create new content just so that we aren't playing along in another player's story is very daunting, when nothing really ever was done with what I already struggled to write. It's one of the many reasons I wish we impacted the story more by what is done at events, rather than what get's put in the in-between event stuff, because everything is balanced and at least semi-public.

Creating ideas in a vacuum for what our characters have accomplished in the five-year span is rough, as many times I tried to accomplish things as Marcus as in-between events actions, only to get a "Korrigan already did that" response, when there was never anything to give me information otherwise. It was very discouraging and made me feel like I was fumbling in the dark to get anything that would make me feel like I made any kind of impact on the game world. This could be that to the extreme.

Also, I am trying to get Dani to contact you, or at least maybe you two could hash things out at the one-day, as especially after the one-day it is going to be literally impossible for her to find time to fit with the timetable you have given for inputting stuff on her character's part.

[Kiel Reid]

My feelings on the 5 year jump is as such...

I'm not a fan of it. If you want to lead us into this era of peace an prosperity then let's work for it. Let's actually have some plots that revolve around that and we can make it happen.

Instead what is happening is people are writing about what they did and it will have a significant effect on a live action game. I echo CJ's sentiment in regards to this. I understand that you want to give people the opportunity to progress themselves so that they are not just sitting there. It just seems cheap to me.

This is going to sound crazy but hear me out a little. Don't do any jump. Scrap it completely. It's just the beginning of the era of prosperity and right now we can all feed ourselves (Thus no upkeep). If you want to make the focus personal development then write plots that reflect that. Keep this from being a game where people can accomplish through writing what they couldn't through roleplay.

[Marcus]

Also, ironically, writing fluff for what we have done for the five years of prosperity and how it integrates our characters upon playing at the first full event of the year? That's only one year less of fluff than what Marcus' backstory entailed for me when I first started playing him 2 years ago- it had been four years since the Night of the Burning Skulls and the fall that I returned to playing him. Now I have to do that again, but on top of very little exposition of what happened in regards to the first chunk of four years, lol.

So little in fact that I could basically ignore the last two years and say that I am returning in the Spring after being gone for nearly seven (edit: nine) years after the group arrived in Far Reach.

An entire season of growth encouraged by the GM staff, where NPC people around Haven actually came to the characters that we have been trying to foster goodwill and renown between, would be awesome. Even if it had to come after an in-game time jump of just six months to a single year.

[Torakhan]

I'm just going to throw this out here as a suggestion, as flawed as it is, but what if each event takes place a year apart from one another In-Game? That way by 2015, we're 5 years ahead, but still giving PCs an opportunity to RP together the actions that brought them about?

[Marcus]

That would really be quite interesting and cool, too. Cool idea, Art.

[GM-Mike]

I certainly understand the concerns. I promise writing ability will not be an influential factor for us and that being poor writers will not lead to suffering of any kind, and I apologize if it has in the past--I'm certain that was never our intention.

We have received submissions already, and they are perfect examples of what I am looking for. The longest submission was 145 words. They simply talk about the goals the players have, possibly the general feel the village has toward them, nothing overly detailed. If you have submitted histories in the past or if we know your character well due to detailed in between events and just want to say you are continuing down those paths and maybe here are a couple character concepts of my closest allies, then great.

Nobody though is going to be playing somebody else's story. You will have great impact on your personal stories if you submit them, and we will use all of it (with possible alterations made if necessary due to you contradicting yourself ("I am evil, everyone loves me") or something not fitting into the world ("I am going to be the new leader of the red tear, even though Mike had said there will be no further mention of them after the one day")). You will have impact on NPC characters that intersect your personal story and possibly on the general view of your character, but the world itself, the world all of your stories will live in and the world your new stories will be created, that stuff will come from us.

And yes, I will sit down with Dani at the one day and we'll figure it out. I'll even put her ahead of board games--that should tell you how highly I prioritize it.

All of that said, I know some of you don't want a time jump, heck maybe most of you. I recognize that perhaps it's more for me than for the game, and if I hear that message from more and more people, we'll figure something else out. I just know that by the end of last year, heck maybe even the beginning of last year, I was tired, and I realized that if I was going to continue to give this game everything I've got, I needed a clean break from the stories that have been told and a fresh start. The time jump is not a new idea and one that I resisted for years now, but the arguments for such a time jump have won me over and also provide me with the fresh start I'm looking for. And while I do recognize this may be more for me, I also truly believe it's also best for the game.

Still, I welcome your comments, concerns, and questions. As Christen would always say, you guys have the power as you guys pay to play, and if the response is overwhelmingly negative, I imagine there is time to change course. I haven't heard from many. Thus far it's about 50/50, so let others know to weigh in.

Mike

[GM-Amanda]

Well, if you want a reply...

I'm ambivalent, leaning towards Art's idea/no jump at all. With very rare exception, I have always come up with a character and concept and let the roleplay dictate how the character evolves. This is LARP, not a novel. I'd much rather have other characters/events influence my decision about how Cirrus grows and changes instead of making those decisions in a vacuum. This is not to say I don't have ideas about what *might* transpire, but some of them are very heavy repercussions that would only happen if something else did, sometimes multiple somethings. And sometimes the smallest things can cause the biggest changes, and the difference can't be decided unless they're played out. (See Zeira, Marcus and Cirrus facing down the huge horde of zombies)

However, I have noticed the flag in storytelling (you said it first!), and if you feel you need to skip time to allow us to get better GM story, then you gotta do that. But I don't think it needs to be that drastic.

And I wrote parts of Cirrus' backstory SPECIFICALLY to give you plot hooks to bother me with. Do you need more?

[GM-Mike]

I can never have enough things to bother you with.

And I do know it's drastic, but it could always be worse. There are some that wanted to jump ahead fifty years...Just saying. And there has been a flag in storytelling, no question.

[Kaylan Chargeender]

I would say any "power" we have because we "pay to play" is moot if your creative well has dried up; therefore whatever it takes to energize your evil sadistic bastage plot tendencies SHOULD be supported and not lamented. Anything less is inconsiderate of the work put in by those that DO NOT pay to essentially run themselves ragged to entertain us. I might feel different if you were truly running FH as a for profit business, but you aren't.

As for your 5 year plan, I am completely fine with going along if its what is determined you need to do to keep things rolling forward and even possible rebooting the creative. I think Art's suggestion could work as well, and might give the plot team the ability to craft the future better, so to speak, as it wont have to be done all at once AND each jump will give the players a chance to react to what each of the other players has done along the way. It might prevent a lot of “well if I had known he/she/they were doing that I would have done things differently” at the first full event

For example, It might cause some butt hurt if I brought back the orcs like they used to be and caused the same in game friction, like any group of gruff savages is expected to, and I also have 5 years to get them dug into the world setting like a tick. a 5 year synopsis can lead to them being very established, where as the one year jumps gives the town the opportunity to react and address the tribe if they are less than accepted, like the orcs were the first time around.

Another alternative is to post the five year update in the continuing adventures section, and allow players to submit in between event reactions to it. That however smacks of a bunch of extra work for the plot gods....

[GM-Mike]

A lot of extra work, yes, but that was my current plan was to give (hopefully) weekly updates in game as to the progression of the world starting a week after the one day and ending just before the first event so it's not a total surprise as to what has happened/going on. These updates ideally will be extensive stories and players would have the opportunity to respond/alter their stories as appropriate.

[Marcus]

I totally understand the feel you have for a (sort of) clean slate for new storytelling on your part; one that doesn't necessarily have to be building upon existing storylines to avoid stagnation. (But smack the one who thought of a fifty year jump- I refuse to play a new character because someone else says I suddenly have to play in a timeline taking place after my character's lifespan. As it is if I was still playing Rhul, and stuck to the beastman lifespan, I would have to come up with a damn good reason as to why I'm not suddenly starting the season as a Venerable character.)

I actually think Art's idea of a year between events would be pretty cool as being a less drastic step. It would jump the timeline forward each time, culminating in the final five-year difference, but at the same time players would be able to write in small bits about what they did in the year following each event, based upon the things that happened at those events as a nice catalyst.

Say that an event in the summer represented "the year of the Orcs", when an Orc declaring himself a warlord tries to raise an army to defeat Haven and rule in the King's place and we mobilize to stop him. Hardly an apocolyptic event, but a nice emergency requiring our attention that's also contained entirely in a single event. Sometime during that event, I happen to lead a group that comes across 10-15 refugees. In my between event's stuff, I could not say that Marcus spent the last year, among other things, helping them get settled in.

I know my writing can come much easier when I have something I can react to. Coming up with things in a vacuum that I then solve as a big hero seems too much like "roleplaying masturbation" to me, and makes me too self-conscious to do well. On the other hand the small "everyman" things I am doing as Marcus to gain renown among the Haven populace is something I have already been trying to do for two years already.

But that being said I can understand. Especially as Marcus. While the Night of the Burning Skulls was something that was pivotal in taking him from an "NPC" to a PC hero, the four-year time lapse between when that happened and when I came in as him made that event something that drove him, but wasn't something I was keeping alive as an active storyline.

A lot of extra work, yes, but that was my current plan was to give (hopefully) weekly updates in game as to the progression of the world starting a week after the one day and ending just before the first event so it's not a total surprise as to what has happened/going on. These updates ideally will be extensive stories and players would have the opportunity to respond/alter their stories as appropriate.

Unfortunately... that kind of flies against your timeline of having a deadline of a month before the first event to send in character fiction, unless you are going to change something.